Games Workshop taking advance orders for new Finecast Space Marines

By Polar_Bear
In 40K
May 13th, 2012
25 Comments
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Games Workshop is taking advance orders for some new Finecast Space Marine sets. Get yours first!

From the update:

Available on advance order this weekend is a huge number of Citadel Finecast Space Marine miniatures. From heroes such as Librarians, Chaplains, Captains and Techmarines, to bigger units including Veteran Squads and the Legion of the Damned, there is something for every single Space Marine player. What’s more there are several bitz packs to upgrade your armies, from Crimson Fists Shoulder Pads to a White Scars Bike Squad Upgrade Pack. There are even Casualties to represent when your dice rolls go badly.

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  • metalsifter

    So in addition to the advance orders, are they going to take advanced orders for miscast replacements as well? ;P

    • Veritas

      Actually, I’ve ordered a few fineca$t minis from the new Empire stuff and they were all perfect. I think GW has gotten their quality control back on task after the abysmal launch. They’re still ridiculously expensive, but the quality seems to be much better now.

      • metalsifter

        I’ve heard far different from several of the casters and moldmakers at GW, since I used to work there. I was told they are only getting about 40% yield from Finecast, when they had a 90% yield with metal.

        I’ve seen 3 pics of good models so far (2 still had flaws, but were acceptable), and all of the GW stores here in the Seattle area have piles of opened boxes from replacing Finecast errors as of yesterday.

        Finecast is now and always will be crap.

        • Sejanus

          How dare you say the King has no clothes….lol.

          Just remember folks..the future of GW is finecast, which I think we can agree kinda speaks for itself…lol

      • Bellygrub

        I’ve had six finecast models that have all been perfect so far (Well one had some bubbles under the crotch but since they’d never be seen I didn’t care). Definately better then the crappy non fitting metals I was used to working with from GW.

        My friend did return his one Finecast purchase because the axe was warped…but really that was just him being a %$&#

        • metalsifter

          So basically it wasn’t perfect, it was a miscast.

          This is what GW is counting on, you the customer being complacent and not expecting the “highest quality miniatures int he world” from them, which is what they advertise.

          Regarding the “non-fitting metals” you mentioned, Finecast models are made using the same masters that metal models were made from, so they would, if you accept reality, have the same gaps and issues the metal ones had. Even the newer Finecast models that were not made previously in metal are mastered using the same process, so you would still have gaps since resin has a tendancy to warp and bend far more than metal did.

          I know, since I made molds for GW for many years.

          Finecast and metal have similar quality issues; mold lines, flash, shifting, no fill.

          But one thing Finecast has that metal doesn’t is bubbles, which makes it an inferior product.

    • Ghost

      I have to be fair and say the handful of Failcast models I’ve purchased have only been slightly warped/bubbled and easily fixed with moderate hobby skill.

    • KelRiever

      Finecast would matter to me if I ever purchased any. Since I’m not, well, my sympathy goes out to those who do.

  • Borzag

    Quick one gents: what’s the pricing like on your side of the pond?

    I haven’t sat down & looked at it in detail, but WAU’s crying foul of the TFC in paticular (now a mighty AUD $92 in Failcast). Among others. I know it’s GW and therefore to be expected, but speaking as someone who does a lot of overseas work, I’m curious as to how big an increase you’re seeing.

    • I’m not exactly sure if you’re asking us Americans or Brits.. or who.. but you can log into the Games Workshop page for different countries if you’re really curious.
      On this particular issue:
      Thunderfire 56
      LotD ~41
      Fists upgrade ~15
      Vulkan ~22

  • KelRiever

    They should just have a kickstarter for all their releases. Like everyone else.

    Then they wouldn’t have to produce figures before they had the money. Even better than pre-orders.

  • keltheos

    Love it Kel, love it.

    For me, asking me to pay them that much for a hunk of plastic and overhyping the quality of overpriced hunk of plastic and the two I’ve purchased having issues (regardless of how small – see price/quality claim whine above), Finecast is DOA. I’ll need to see extensive reports of no issues (not small issues) before I’ll drop money on one of them again. I’ve stayed away from the Mangler Squigs and Jabberslythe (Two models I would very much like to get ahold of) only because they’re Finecast.

    • Mananarepublic

      “asking me to pay them that much for a hunk of plastic and overhyping the quality of overpriced hunk of plastic ”

      That’s the way I feel about PP…

      /M

      • metalsifter

        Interesting. I have 3 Carnivean plastic kits right in front of me, assembling them right now and I don’t see a single bubble at all. Every part filled perfectly, no miscasts at all.

        No heavy flash, vents or mold lines like Finecast either. Also everything filled properly too, unlike FC where half a bolter or backpack doesn’t fill.

        Most of the injection points are all hidden in areas that get glued together too.

        Unlike GW, Privateer Press didn’t have to sell gullible consumers new product to hide their own manufacturing flaws like liquid green stuff.

        Best part of all, I don’t have to go back to the store and return them and hope the replacement doesn’t have issues as well. That is, IF the GW store even has another copy to replace it with. If not then I’ll have to wait even longer for a replacement that in all likelyhood will have just as many if not more issues.

        Gotta love GW and their PR machine, I was always in awe of what they can convince customers of.

        • Dead right.. I’d like to add: If I bought a Tamiya or Dragon kit with resin in it and it had those kinds of problems, I’d be returning it.. However.. they don’t have those kinds of problems.. If GW is going to price their models like the high-detail military model kits, then it should be held to that standard of quality as well. Looking at the tabletop market as well, I would say the huge majority of resin casters also does not have that sort of issue. I just can’t fathom how GW can be so out of depth.
          I also don’t understand why they would invest so much money in researching plastic injection only to turn around and rely so heavily on resin. Didn’t they blame several years worth of price hikes on that expensive machine that was able to cast hollow pieces and undercuts in plastic? What happened to that?

          • metalsifter

            The machine GW uses for the hollow cannons is the same as the others, it’s the “tool” or mold that has the mechanical parts that makes it able to do that. That’s the expensive part, but even then that tech has been around since the 70’s, it was only new to GW.

            They had the same problem then that they do now, very few people within the company really know moldmaking and casting techniques to the degree they need them to.

            Most of the guys at GW learned how at GW using only GW techniques. That is a very small drop in a large pond of knowledge.

            The few staff they had in Lenton and Memphis that did have that kind of in-depth knowledge were slowly weeded out, fired or made redundant over the years. Those guys now work for other companies like PP, Mantic, Foundry, Warlord Games etc.

            GW are their own worst enemy right now.

        • mathieu

          I have a couple of plastic kits from PP, and I saw “out of the box” pictures from a number of websites. All of them, every single one, have extensive mould lines. I cracked open the two new Leviathan boxes at the LGS the other day, same story. I haven’t purchased the Trollkin Fennblades because, out of the dozen or so boxes that came and went at the LGS, none of them was even close to acceptable in terms of mould lines. And the injection points that aren’t hidden (which aren’t as rare as you make it sound) can be either in inconvenient to clean areas, or large protuberances that warp the whole sculpt around them (cf. top of the Slayer’s kit carapace).

          There obviously are no bubbles since PP plastic kits aren’t resin models. On the other hand, there are plenty of mould lines, and the material is not nearly as easy to clean as metal or resin. Even a caster from PP (or former caster) would admit on Warseer that the material they’d chosen was essentially crap…
          And PP doesn’t have to learn anything from GW as far as selling inferior products to gullible customers. They sell resin kits are the same price or more expensive than similarly sized FW kits, yet they are vastly less detailed and the casting quality is terrible. And they have no problem claiming that all these quality control issues are completely to be expected for resin models…

          I’m not saying that GW should be praised for releasing poor quality finecast models. I’ve had my share of these, including in the replacement pieces I was sent. But claiming that PP is any better than GW in that department is just dedicated fan shortsightedness…

          • metalsifter

            My point being is that PP keeps improving their product, I’ve seen no improvement in GW’s Finecast at all.

            PP early plastics did have issues, which they have corrected on newer kits, even changing the plastic to something better, and the newest kits are even better in terms of mold lines and injection points.

            As for their resin kits, I’ve bought thousands of dollars from FW both as an employee and a customer and have had issues with most of them.

            The only issue I’ve had with PP resins, the Battle Engines, was a few warped parts which is easily fixed. That is a common and standard issue with resin even with the Japanese Mecha kits like the ones from G-System. I’ve found PP resin kits to be just as detailed as GW kits, although probably not in as many parts since GW cuts up the models to make moldmaking easier for their unskilled laborers in Lenton to produce. PP has actual experienced staff making their resin kits.

            I’ve worked for both companies, PP has by far the better Quality Control and quality product than GW.

          • mathieu

            The only issue I’ve had with PP resins, the Battle Engines, was a few warped parts which is easily fixed. That is a common and standard issue with resin even with the Japanese Mecha kits like the ones from G-System. I’ve found PP resin kits to be just as detailed as GW kits, although probably not in as many parts since GW cuts up the models to make moldmaking easier for their unskilled laborers in Lenton to produce. PP has actual experienced staff making their resin kits.

            Well let’s just agree to disagree, then. All the PP resin kits I’ve seen had bad, inconveniently located mould lines. And, while the Hordes models finally did get decent as far as details go, the first four WM ones were far from the level of FW stuff. Very far. Yet they were already priced at the same level as FW stuff.
            Barely any warping on my end, though but I’d much rather get warped pieces than the terrible quality of the PP kits I’ve had the misfortune to work on.

            PP have very experienced casters working on their metal models and it shows. Except for the few, understandable miscast pieces I’ve ran into, I’ve always been impressed by the consistent quality of their metal pieces. While they may have very good casters working on their resin kits as well, as far as I’m concerned they have yet to show that they can produce consistently decent quality pieces to prove it.

    • KelRiever

      It is so true…there are models I might buy….if they weren’t finecast. In fact, if an old metal exists for a figure I want, I’m going to eBay first. But yeah, new models in Finecast…I’ll just let those go, even if I want them.

  • Doc

    so no Mephiston in Finecast? Even if it is not a re-sculpt? sheesh…

  • ninja007

    There is a simple factual reason Finecast minis do indeed have a better fit than metals do. Metal shrinks and does not fill out a mold as well, period. This is the cause and it’s just a fact of life.

    One would also hope that when GW retooled the molds & models (which they did by necessity, it’s not avoidable) they would have fixed them up a bit while filling in undercuts and all that jazz. But who knows with GW.

    • Well, you also would think that instead of re-releasing the old old model that is the Chaos Dreadnought that they would design a new one and make THAT finecast.. I would wager that they’ll just transfer the current (ancient) one to resin though..

    • metalsifter

      That’s not how it works though. GW is using the same METAL masters to make the molds for Finecast models for existing models in the range.

      That means when the mold is pressed it is heated, expanding the metal masters inside the mold, which means the cavities inside the mold also expand. Since it’s under pressure and heat when it vulcanizes the cavities are actually larger than the finished model is supposed to be. The mold then cools, shrinking the cavities in it, but it’s an uneven shrink. That’s when you get the gaps in-between parts.

      When the model is mastered and cut apart the gaps are all filled so it looks just as it did when it was whole, no gaps. The gaps occur due to uneven vulcanization and cooling. Since Finecast molds are still made using those masters and process, the same thing happens.

      For newer models that were not mastered in metal first, they are using resin masters instead of metal. Resin also expands under heat. They use the same process, but with resin masters.

      Not only do resin masters expand under heat, but they also get soft, disfigure and warp under lower temperatures than metal. So resin masters have similar issues when being vulcanized, just in a different way.

      Whether it’s metal or resin the problem is that when you heat up the parts that deforms them, it’s an unfortunate side effect of the process itself.

      • Hey Metalsifter, PP is looking for casters.. you seem to know what you’re talking about.. thought I would point it out if you missed it.