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  • Ask Jean Bey: the answers parts 1 and 2

    Jean Bey has sent along the first two parts of his answers to the questions posed by TGN readers. Part three is scheduled to be released on Wednesday next week.

    AT-43

    Can you tell us what the next AT-43 factions will be?

    The next AT-43 faction will be the Cogs.

    Cog concept art
    Click to enlarge

    The civilization designated by this name has not developed as a coherent whole. It is not held together by any sense of belonging. The Cogs do not feel they belong to the same species, race or any other word used by more primitive life forms. The Cogs are a relatively loose alliance of four genetic bloodlines. The best and more advanced lineages their original species ever gave birth to. Each bloodline is considered a civilization of its own. They are the closest to what non-cogs generally qualify as a species.

    What are the future plans for AT-43 beyond the upcoming campaign book?

    We are working on several projects for AT-43. Just before the new Operation: Frostbite campaign (available for GenCon USA), we are going to publish an augmented version of the Damocles campaign developed in Cry Havoc last year. This Campaign Book will compile the elements previously published and will include rules for the Karmans. So this campaign will be playable with all the factions presented in the Army Books. In September, just after Operation: Frostbite, we will publish AT-43 Tactics. This book will complete and improve the rules tested by the readers of Cry Havoc. These two supplements, Campaign Book Operation: Damocles and AT-43 Tactics, are an answer to strong demands on behalf of our players. Each book will be complete and will take into account all the miniatures available by the time of their release. Later their will be a new game mode dedicated to heroic pilots and their vehicles: Armored Heroes.

    There has been some concern over how attachment boxes are being handled in AT-43. This seems to be rectified with newer releases such as the Karmans. Is Rackham planning on re-releasing these older attachment boxes (Therians, UNA, Red Blok) in a more logical manner to reflect how the newer boxes are handled?

    Indeed, we have solved the packaging problem with the arrival of the fourth army, the Karmans. The next Attachment Boxes and the new rules introduced by Operation: Frostbite will benefit from a new packaging to make sure everything in the box can be played.

    Prior to the AT-43 release we saw a supposed Rackham concept mini -a robot or power armor suit -that I can only describe as being very anime in design. Was this a Rackham design? Whatever happened with it? Will we see it again?

    It is a Rackham miniature indeed, but it was made during the pre-production phase of AT-43. It allowed us to carry out technical tests for combat striders notably: nature of the plastic, number of pieces per mould, number of moulds needed to produce a large piece, and so on. While we were adjusting the industrial production technical details, the universe of AT-43 was evolving. In the end, the faction, to which this robot belonged, did not make the final cut in the development of the first edition of AT-43. For the time being, it is not on the production plan. However, it could find its way into the Rackham Legends range.

    Will the other AT-43 factions Type 3 heroes be AFV bound as well?

    No.

    When will we be seeing support units for AT-43?

    These units will be playable with the Attachment Boxes thanks to the new rules from Operation: Frostbite.

    There has been some controversy about the Operation Frostbite playtest rules. As Frostbite is so close to release, is there any chance that these rules will be changed based on feedback from players?

    We asked the community to test and contribute to balancing the rules for Operation: Frostbite. We always intended to consider their feedback. What would have been the point if we didnt? In my opinion, the community gathered around our games should take part in the development of certain aspects of our universe. This doesnt mean we dont know want we are doing.

    Of course, there will be no consensus possible when you allow thousands of players to give their opinion, but there is always a tendency that appears. Concerning these tests, they allowed us to evaluate the level of complexity we could introduce with extra rules. In addition, it also helped us avoid certain mistakes. Though our team is the architect behind the game, it is only logical to ask the community when we are having hesitations. We are thinking about doing it again later in order to associate the gamers to selected projects.

    Confrontation

    Do you feel that converting Confrontation entirely to plastic was a little bit too bold? The sheer number of models that need to be converted will take several years, no? Will an army that’s far down the pipe in development terms see no support other than the online PDF until they start to get plastics?

    I believe the rhythm of our releases is pretty fast for both Confrontation and AT-43. The online Army Books are there for those who want to play their armies with the metal miniatures already available. The online Army Books allow you to build banners and to play the Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok game system with the existing metal pieces. Though the new system is very different from everything else we’ve done until now and requires more pieces than the previous editions of the game, most pieces are still compatible. By the end of the year we should be able to upload an Army Book dedicated to the Drune, the Mid- Nor and the Sessairs so these armies can be played along side those that have been kept for The Age of the Rag’narok. The book could be printed later on.

    Have you started work on the Cynwall at all? I have seen a preview of the Lions online and their armor has lost a great deal of the detail they used to have. How will this translate on the Cynwall which, I feel, was the most intricately detailed army in terms of armor?

    Producing plastic models certainly does not impose that our models become less detailed. Just look at the Aberration Prime for instance: it is far more “readable” and has a superior level of detail compared to the metal model, while offering the modularity that is impossible with metal!

    The Tir-na-bor Golem is another example.

    Tir-na-bor Golem
    Click to enlarge

    Working to create new models for existing Confrontation troops is particularly difficult since the universe is very dense and, visually speaking, extremely diverse. When we started working on the new sculptures for Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok, we decided we needed to revisit our archetypes to make it easier for the player to “read” the miniatures. We are at a level of global quality I believe has never yet been attained in PPP, and it’s only the beginning.

    Confrontation has enjoyed incredible success over the years. It has sold over seven million blister packs and boxed references. Unlike AT-43, the players have got used to strong visuals over time. For a time we thought we had met our players’ expectations with the escalation in detail and sophistication, and yet I believe we lost sight of what was essential: we’re not just making minis, we’ve making a coherent and complete range.

    How many factions for CAoR do you plan to release in 2008? How many in 2009?

    Four factions will be released by the end of the year. Four or five more next year. This means more than half of the peoples of Aarklash will have an Army Book. We also need to keep in mind that some armies have two or three Army books planned – Temple, Inquisition and Lodge of Hod for the Griffins, or two groups of Houses of Acheron, and so on. While sharing the same “standard” troops, we want to give special pieces to these armies to differentiate them. So you will get to play the same army in many different ways, renewing the gaming pleasure without having to buy loads of pieces.

    Lahnars
    Click to enlarge

    The next armies set for release are the Lahnars for the Lion, The Spirit of the Bran-Ô-Kor for the Tree- spirit, Acheron for the Ram and Armageddon for the Hyena.


    Click to enlarge

    Are there any plans to revisit a skirmish based system like Confrontation 3 in the future?

    During the designing of Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok, we wanted it to remain possible to play both “skirmish” and “battle” games. Though we do not consider Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok to be a skirmish game, some players would like a “Dogs of War-like” gaming level, meaning a level of detail and individualization of the Confrontation pieces comparable to Confrontation 3. Several months ago, AT-43 players discovered AT-43 Tactics. This game system is played on a smaller scale. It makes every miniature an individual; not only Incarnate characters as in Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok. The feedback we got for AT-43 Tactics will allow us to offer a Tactics game mode for Confrontation for the beginning of next year.

    It appears that most PPP Wolfen troopers so far share a great deal of pieces, not only within units, but also from one unit to the next. Do you think you’ll eventually produce individually sculpted plastic models in the future to increase the variety of poses in the Wolfen army?

    Yes, though you need to bear in mind that the wolfen available are the first series of pieces sculpted over a year and a half ago. At lot of progress was made, as you will have noticed with the various previews we post every week on Internet. We are following a fast but classical technical evolution – as it was the case with the metal miniatures from 1998 to 2008.

    Wolfen
    Click to enlarge

    The brightest examples would be the difference between the standard bearer of Urland (April 1998) and the legendary standard bearer (2005) or the aberration made for Hybrids (2003) and the plastic Aberration Prime (2006).

    Aberration Prime
    Click to enlarge

    When I read, for instance, that the plastic Griffin heavy cavalry is less detailed than it would have been in metal, it is not true. They would have been just the same in metal since they were sculpted from a concept that was intended for metal release – the first concepts were visible in old Cry Havoc issues. In addition, the pieces themselves were initially sculpted to be released in metal. It is only later that we decided to reserve them for a plastic release!

    Another example: the plastic pieces from the Attachment Box: Great Fangs for the Wolfen. We sometimes use models from the metal range on purpose to show that there is no loss in detail. People need to keep in mind that an unpainted model always seems more complex as it is the painter who chooses what to emphasize instead of something else. The paintjob also needs to make the piece recognizable on the gaming table.

    Is the release of unpainted plastic models (like the quite interesting looking Flesh Golem) still planned?

    The Flesh Golem will be first released in resin, unpainted and unassembled, as part of the Legends range. Later there will be a PPP release to accompany the mystics supplement book. In March 2007, when we communicated and explained the reasons why we were changing to ready assembled and painted plastic, I also stated that we would still release metal and resin miniatures. Unfortunately, the part of the message directed at players who are into miniatures that require assembling and painting was outshone by the PPP announcement. The announcement was carried from one forum to the next and, in the end, the whole message was changed.

    How do you explain the difference in pricing or packaging between metal and plastic miniatures?

    The price of a metal miniature is mainly based on the price of its raw material, as opposed to plastic. The main costs of producing plastic miniatures concern the industrial process: equipment, technology…but you can cast hundred of miniatures with a limited quantity of oil. On the other hand, the increasing cost of metal has a major impact on the final price. The price increases of raw material will have exponential repercussions on any metal product. Some players simply refuse to look around: why have so many companies turned to plastic? Rackham is not the only one. By choosing PPP today, Rackham is one step ahead of others. As pioneers, we are faced with heavy criticism, but metal doesn’t meet the players’ expectations, nor does it correspond to those of distribution.

    When did you decide that CAoR would utilize the same mechanics as AT-43? Why?

    As soon as we began designing AT-43, I wanted our games to share common core mechanisms, the same backbone, so that a player who is familiar with one of our game systems could naturally find his way into another of our universes. You might want a change of atmosphere, another universe, without having to learn to play an entirely new game. A well built system should be able to open to other universes simply and naturally. I wanted us to be as innovative as we have been in the past: besides the quality of the miniatures, the fact that we were providing cards that contained all the required information as well as a rule booklet had been a major innovation in miniature gaming. It was the key to our success. It made our miniatures and game, Confrontation, more accessible than any other game.

    Today all the other manufacturers are using a similar system… It has even become the standard. The success of Confrontation and the evolution of the miniature gaming market mainly relies on the principle that a reference comes with a card and ready to play rules. Yet I believe we need to take it even further, and that calls for PPP. Coming back to the game system and considering the principle mentioned above, I wanted, among other things, a system that would use a single universal table to resolve most actions. Indeed, I believe that a game system should serve the fun and social aspect of gaming rather than tend towards simulation only offering a single point of view – and this is a casual Squad Leader player speaking, and who also appreciates the apparent simplicity and tactical depth of a game like Space Hulk! A game system needs to stay simple and still offer real elements of strategy that bring depth to the game and provide real challenges for the players. Though the backbone of our systems might be similar, each universe has its own identity and particularities.

    If it is possible to offer the metal miniatures for sale through FFG alongside the PPP range would it not be possible to continue selling them with their Confrontation 3 playing cards or to make their old Confrontation cards available online as a downloadable pdf resource? Do you have any plans of releasing the full Confrontation 3 rules to the general public as a PDF download?

    In a few weeks time we will be opening on www.confrontation.fr a section specially dedicated to the previous editions of Confrontation. It will allow you to download the entire rules of Confrontation 3 as well as its supplement Dogs of War and all Confrontation 3 cards for free since, though I believe Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok is the best game system we have ever made for Confrontation, I think it is up to the player to play the system that suits them best. The system is not all, far from it. The universe, the graphics, the miniatures are elements that evolve and that are core components to the interest of the game and the players.

    I see as a sign as more and more players of the previous editions are starting to play the game. The complaining posted on Internet under cover of anonymity does not represent the reality of the market. It would be a mistake to believe that stores would be willing to distribute both a metal range and a painted plastic range of the same universe. Of course, there will always be some people to say they would do it. But economic reality is not built upon a handful of stores. It would take a lot more to make it economically viable. Upholding two totally different production systems, maintaining double references, therefore taking up double shelf space and double costs is pure nonsense.

    How do you feel the new PPP creations by Rackham, such as the new Griffin Musician, Griffin Standard Bearer, Griffin Templars, and Dirz releases compare to the older metal figures such as the Cadwe Bandits, The Priestess of Steel, Mounted Alahan Units and Black Paladins?

    It is a question of technical expertise. Look at the new Lion knights, and compare:

    Lion Knights
    Click to enlarge

    Two years ago, our first pieces meant for plastic suffered from an approach too similar to metal. We hadn’t realized we had changed to a much more constraining industrial process. Two years ago, we had not yet reached the level of mastery AT-43 and the Aberration Prime gave us. Here are some pics of the upcoming plastic Red Lioness. The sculpting is truer to the concept than the metal version. The sculpting, the casting and the production techniques have totally changed. Finally, with this new plastic version, this Incarnate no longer looks anorexic…

    Red Lioness
    Click to enlarge

    Pacodeth was asking if I honestly thought the new Confrontation pieces could compete with those that were made before the arrival of plastic. Well, to give you an honest answer, as an amateur of miniatures since childhood, after having been part of this industry for more than twenty years and being the owner of an unbelievable number of miniatures from all sorts of manufacturers, the answer cannot be limited to this level and it is not only a question of taste either. As the creator and artistic director of Rackham, the question is always tackled from various angles: the first question I ask myself when I examine a new concept is “what does it bring to the universe of Confrontation?”. What effects will the miniatures I am imagining produce on the players? By players, I mean the painter, the player and the fan of fantasy. What counts is the creativity we put into making pieces for the pleasure of an incredible number of people. Some people might smile when I say that I often spend an awful lot of time scrutinizing every piece all along at every stage of its development.

    The sculptors, the game designers, the writers and the graphic artists, they all know how demanding I can be concerning the finishing of our products, no matter if it is a miniature, a paint job or a book. It is no hazard our products are so well finished. It is because everyone working for the studio wants to give his or her best. This is why the relationship between players and Rackham is so passionate. Today the universes we created are yours. Some players seem to resume the work we do every day at the studio to “I like it” – “or not”. You cannot please everyone, but we work for the players and if they had not supported us all the way, we wouldn’t be around having this discussion. Do I like the plastic miniatures as much as the metal one? I like them as much as the first metal piece we created for Confrontation in 1998! Less than those created in 2008 and less still than those that will be made next year or the year after that. To answer Henni.B (who happens to be an illustrator), being creative means being able to question your work again and again, in spite of the fact there will never be any possible compromise.

    Making exceptional sculptures is not all it takes to meet the expectations of such a rich and diverse community. Rackham is a game company that creates magical universes for players. No customer is more important than the rest. There are only customers who want to dream and take part in great adventures. This is the reason why we gather around a table to play or admire a paintjob; it is our escape from reality. In any case, we do it for the journey and certainly not for the anatomy lessons or the casting techniques or the economics…All that counts is the pleasure of the experience, no matter if it is metal, plastic, painted or only base coated. My dream is to see the spark in the eyes of those I meet in the stores or at conventions because they give me the energy to do even better next time.

    What was the reason that Rackham moved from a skirmish system for Confrontation to the new mass combat system?

    We were the first to develop a fantasy skirmish game. Today it’s what everybody is doing… No matter what the critics say, we have chosen an open system rather than limit ourselves to one game mode. We offer to play at several levels depending on how you want to play. It was the same thing as Confrontation and Rag’narok except that today it is a single game system so that the game is both rich in terms of universe and balance.

    What defines a “Legends” miniature?

    Rackham Legends is the brand under which all the pieces produced since the creation of Confrontation will be gathered. This range is not meant to stop with the arrival of plastic. On the contrary, Rackham Legends will offer new pieces to those who have this other approach to miniatures. These pieces are legendary since they represent the spirit of innovation and the passion animating Rackham since its creation. Its passion for sculpture, miniatures and fantasy worlds. In addition, they contribute to the quality trademark claimed by the players that follow us. These pieces are our past, our present and our future. They are our legend.

    Will the upcoming Dirz Wyrm and the other Legends releases you mention get C3 profiles and cards?

    Allowing the free download of our games and cards, representing more than ten years of development, means also that we are making it possible to discover and test our games. On top of that, it answers part of our community’s expectations. We have decided that Aarklash had to evolve with our new game system to become more accessible. We have re-balanced the armies as it became unavoidable, like any other game with a universe so rich. Miniature and RPG players – including those playing on new media – know what I am talking about. Besides, after ten years, the card based system had grown unbearable even to the most motivated players. To avoid choking what we have been doing for ten years, we had to clean it out. The first signs of the market’s evolution back in early 2005 led me down this road. Some people won’t be happy when I say we won’t develop anymore official Confrontation 3 profiles. And considering the development going on around AT-43 and Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok, even if we wanted to, we would not have the time.

    What happened to the plans for limited metal support for unreleased factions?

    The factions that are not planned for PPP will get Legends releases.

    How do the sales of CAoR compare to Confrontation when Confrontation had the same number of miniatures released? Exact amounts aren’t required (and obviously wouldn’t be provided due to industry competition reasons).

    A question asked by Primarch I believe. I won’t be giving any precise numbers but rather make a comparison between both games for an equivalent number of months and releases. Considering the same period, we currently sell thirteen times more Confrontation: The Age of the Rag’narok miniatures than at the launch of the first edition of Confrontation which, in fact, came out with more references available.

    What is the future of Cadwallon, the tactical role-playing game?

    Cadwallon will get one or two Army Books for you to play the guilds and the militia. We are contemplating the possibility of starting a subscription for the English version of Secrets 2. If it works, the book will be printed. We will send their copies to the subscribers and the surplus stock will be distributed by our partners.

    What is the difference between the online cards and those from the card packs you sell?

    The online cards correspond to a test version of the game. As the Army books and card packs are released, the online material will be removed or corrected depending on the differences between the versions.

    44 Responses to “Ask Jean Bey: the answers parts 1 and 2”


    LarkinVain says:

    Lots of exciting stuff. I really like the multiple ways to play AT-43 with AT-43 Tactics skirmish game and Amored Heroes AFV game. It gives more bang to your buck with minis you currently own.

    Same for Confrontation. I look forward to seeing the skirmish rules they have in store for that as well.

    Thank you Jean for answering so many questions and even going further by including lots of new preview pictures. Greatly appreciated.


    Gitteau says:

    It’s mostly dodging and lofty language as camouflage, his trademarks. His response to the Confrontation skirmish question was in fact anticipated exactly, and referenced in the original draft of the question (something like “and we don’t mean something like AT-43:Tactics). I especially like the jab at internet fans in an interview designed to cater to that same audience. The answer about playtesting is also extremely disingenuous. “We want your opinions, but are sure that we know better than you.”

    There are a few items of interest, mainly Armored Heroes and the dedicated webspace for C3 (too bad this wasn’t a traditional interview, I would have loved to hear more about this. is a revision planned? etc.), but not enough to keep me on board.


    Marauder says:

    It was nice for him to include some previews of new confrontation minis and sketches for AT-43. Also nice to know that the army of the Hyena isn’t so far down the pipe.

    -Tim


    LarkinVain says:

    I especially like the jab at internet fans in an interview designed to cater to that same audience.
    You’re assuming that all those who read this interview took a jab from him. I for one did not.


    Zac says:

    His response to the Confrontation skirmish question was in fact anticipated exactly, and referenced in the original draft of the question

    If you know that someone isn’t going to answer a question the way you want then why ask it?


    Zac says:

    You’re assuming that all those who read this interview took a jab from him. I for one did not.

    I’m not sure what he is referring to at all. Gitteau, what are you thinking is a “jab”?


    GrimDog says:

    “I believe the rhythm of our releases is pretty fast for both Confrontation and AT-43.”

    what world is he living in?


    redstripe (Nick) says:

    A great read. It’s really great to get a looking to Jean Bey’s head, like this.

    My initial reaction to the Confrontation Fiasco has faded and reading this, I find I am open to consider some of the things he’s talking about. A Confrontation Tactics ruleset really caught my interest, as well as resin miniatures in the Legends range.

    Merci Beaucoup, Jean Bey. Thanks for taking the time to answer our questions.


    Zac says:

    what world is he living in?

    What point are you trying to make exactly? How is it that you think the release schedule isn’t adequate?


    Trent McCaffrey says:

    Wow….good news for C3, Cadwallon, and Legends. That’s a lot of support for past product lines that most companies wouldn’t do.

    I’m amazed that there’s still criticism. The only way that would stop is if Rackham took us all back in a time machine.

    The 13X sales amount reassures me. If Confrontation succeeded from that start then I’m pretty sure CAoR will do really well, despite the critics.

    The only question that I think could have been answered better is What defines a Legends mini. The answer wasn’t really clear. Will there be any PPP Legends minis? Does it just mean limited production, multi-part unassembled, high end minis? And the hyperbolic ending ( They are our Legends. ) probably rubbed the critics the wrong way too….just sayin’. :)


    scottywan82 says:

    I’ve never been so excited!!! So many amazing things coming out! Cogs, just for starters. Expanded Damocles campaign. I’m not getting tactics, unless it includes something for the battle game, but neato for those who want it!

    I saved two metal armies, Lions and Hyena, and they get army books soonest!!!!! I’m so happy!! This was the awesoest response ever. Could someone who writes Standard Bearer for White Dwarf (oh… what’s his name? ;-) ) maybe take some notes?! This is how it’s done. Damn fine job, JB. Nothing makes me want to keep buying Rackham more.


    Gitteau says:

    If you know that someone isn’t going to answer a question the way you want then why ask it?

    While AT43:Tactics may use a limited number of models, it isn’t really skirmish level system. It’s more like Hybrid or Space Hulk than anything else. It was poorly received on the AT-43 forum (if we’re allowed to cite anonymous internet comments) and there has been no signs of interest there. No fanmade scenarios or requests for more modules, to my knowledge. It wasn’t my question, but the original writer took some care to explain that AT-43:Tactics isn’t what people are after. I don’t see what’s wrong with making that specification

    I’m not sure what he is referring to at all. Gitteau, what are you thinking is a “jab”?

    This is what I’m referring to:

    “The complaining posted on Internet under cover of anonymity does not represent the reality of the market.”

    “Complaining” and “anonymity” are clearly meant to be pejorative. The point he makes is fine and valid: he believes that you can’t cater to a small group to the detriment of potential consumers. That’s great, but what does anonymity have to do with it? If enough people hassled him in person at GenCon or wherever, would he suddenly change his mind and market skirmish and mass battle games concurrently?


    Zac says:

    It wasn’t my question, but the original writer took some care to explain that AT-43:Tactics isn’t what people are after. I don’t see what’s wrong with making that specification

    My point simply was that it appears that everyone thought he wasn’t going to give you the answer you wanted so why pose the question in the first place if you are expecting to be disappointed? If you have to add a series of qualifiers to a question then you have a problem and perhaps the best approach is to not ask to avoid disappointment. Especially when it sounds as if members of the community have asked the same thing enough to craft qualifiers to manoeuvre around his earlier responses.

    “Complaining” and “anonymity” are clearly meant to be pejorative.

    Complaining is negative but anonymous isn’t really.

    That’s great, but what does anonymity have to do with it?

    Because it is a reality of what happens online. People say negative and rude things in a manner they never would in person at, for example, Gen Con simply because of the anonymity.

    We’ve discussed this very issue here on TGN in a different context and I don’t know that he is attacking any group of people more than he is simply explaining the fact that he listens to sales and not the comments of people who post under pseudonyms.


    nanite (Seth) says:

    Always nice to hear comments from the producers, and get some sneak previews, that golem looks aces!

    My concern is that adding two new ways to play AT-43 seems like a loss of focus. I would rather that time be spent on creating material for the core game.

    Not a huge gripe though.


    Zac says:

    Regarding AT-43 Tactics, I think the biggest reason for its failure may have more to do with it being printed in Cry Havoc magazine instead of being a book on its own. I stopped buying Cry Havoc well before AT-43 came out and so I missed it entirely.


    LarkinVain says:

    Zac, I think you hit the nail on the head. The only thing available was this PDF but it did not outline the complete rules of AT-43 tactics. It says it’s made for 4 - 7 players but I’m hoping the published rules will also allow for a 2 player game.


    primarch says:

    Hi!

    I’m amazed that there’s still criticism. The only way that would stop is if Rackham took us all back in a time machine.

    All too true. For those angry at the switch to PPP, nothing short of “going back in time” would assuage their anger. That this not possible nor economically feasible will not factor into that type of reasoning.

    The 13X sales amount reassures me. If Confrontation succeeded from that start then I’m pretty sure CAoR will do really well, despite the critics.

    Not surprising. I have posted here and on other forums that the info I was getting from national distributors and online vendors was “very good”. I guess I was wrong….

    13x sales is STUPENDOUS!! :)

    Again, not surprising since they are following the AT-43 model which has been, by any measure, highly successful.

    As I have mentioned before, Rackham will obey the dictates of the market. With 13x sales (as well as AT-43 high sales), it is speaking VERY clearly.

    We’ve discussed this very issue here on TGN in a different context and I don’t know that he is attacking any group of people more than he is simply explaining the fact that he listens to sales and not the comments of people who post under pseudonyms.

    I agree. I read no animosity in the statement. As a business person, decisions are made on solid data (i.e. sales figures). I have not seen many companies (game or otherwise) that would change their marketing strategy in light of negative commentary on the internet, much less so when their sales data tells them they are selling very well.

    One can have an opinion of disliking or disliking virtually anything. A consumer has a right to vote with their money and not support a given focus that displeases them.

    Of course, the converse is true. A company has the right to change their focus and marketing to one that provides them greater revenue.

    By all sources available Rackham’s decision is more than vindicated in light of the increased sales.

    Personally I am more interested in the final installment of answers relating to the company. There is only one bit of data I desire to “sew it up” quite nicely and that is whether the debt protection period is over.

    Once that comes through there will be no doubt that their change to PPP was the right choice to make.

    Primarch


    cegorach says:

    I would just like to say that again, Zac, quoting each ‘negative’ comment and rebutting it makes it look like you are ‘defending’ Rackham. I would suggest, again, to maintain the independent nature of TTGN, that you just restrict yourself to general censure and if your users really have to ‘debate it out’ let them do it amongst themselves without you being an active partner.

    Yes, there was plenty of hyperbole. What do people expect? Jean Bey is discussing his business, and something he is passionate about. Of course he is being hyperbolic, that is his job.

    Just to balance a bit, Bey’s comments about complaining and anonymity WERE pejorative. If sales are doing so well, and that kind of commentary irrelevant, why on earth bring it up at all? If we are being all professional then yes, that was a bad move on his part. He doesn’t need to explain with a negative reference at all.

    On the other hand, if it was your business, you’d be a bit on the defensive too.

    As to the thirteen times sales comment, if he is referring to Confrontation when it very first released then it is an apples and oranges comment and not as relevant as might be supposed. You can’t make a straight comparison between a brand new product, breaking new ground in a relatively local market to one that uses a ten+ year old brand name, relatively standard rules and released through international distribution to established markets.

    Then again, that kind of comparison is standard business promotion practice so nothing for the ‘haters’ to get worked up about.


    LarkinVain says:

    Why would Zac have to censure himself? Not all negative comments are quote and rebutted. For example AT-43 tactics failure response. Zac merely outlined why he thought it was a failure. Not exactly something positive but it was a negative response with a descriptive reason.

    Zac’s responses to the negative comments actually help bring the discussion further by asking the poster to elaborate more on their negative comments.

    Also to say Bey’s comments are belittling is really subjective. What’s so negative of stating that complaints online are not a good indicator of things because people can post under the cover of anonymity?

    The 13 times answer is related to a specific question.
    “How do the sales of CAoR compare to Confrontation when Confrontation had the same number of miniatures released? Exact amounts aren’t required (and obviously wouldn’t be provided due to industry competition reasons).”


    cegorach says:

    Please read what I said. I didn’t say Zac should completely censure himself, just not get his hands dirty with rebutting individual posts. Why? Because even though he may not be partisan, and is just attempting to moderate a discussion ‘hands on’, the weight of rebuttal and moderation of negative vs positive makes it LOOK like he is biased.

    He can just as easily (in fact easier!) do what he did previously and make a general comment saying certain kinds of commentary are not constructive, or should be backed up with concrete assertions.

    If R news is going to have back and forth acrimony, as an independent site owner the smartest move is not to get involved or over time you will project either an impression of bias, or an impression of meddling and controlling discussion for whatever agenda. This has been done by other site owners and the eventual results are generally not positive.

    And Larkin, as you have made it abundantly clear you are a fan of R in your many posts here and other places, please do not take my comments as negative criticism, as it looks like you are receiving them that way.

    It is not subjective to call Bey’s comments belittling. Of course they are - if this is a business discussion, they are irrelevant. If not, then they are pejorative. As I said - no need to say it at all, unless you feel a bit defensive and want to hit back a bit.

    And as I also said - fair enough. If it was my business being sledged, I would do the exact same thing myself.

    Also bear in mind the commentary goes both ways. If negative comments are irrelevant to anonymity, so are positive ones. Which I don’t think is strictly true either way.

    As to the 13x comment, I know that. I was just clarifying that it is a bit of a throw away comment and not something that anyone should get too excited about.


    Longbow says:

    I am glad that AT-43 and CAoR are really taking off and that the sales are great. I for one plan to totally dive into both games full throttle. Thanks for this post, both JB for the answers and Zac for providing the neutral ground.

    Imho, JB has every right to jab certain factions of the community as many have been downright rude and obnoxious in the forums precisely due to the ‘cover’ of anonymity. Honestly, many here would likely express their annoyance in a similar way (if not worse) if they were in JB’s shoes! Seriously, the complainers only seem significant on the internet due to their loudness. The market data indicates otherwise and JB has the right to smack these loudmouths with a dose of reality. What, can’t take as good as you give?

    Zac’s frustration is understandable. After sometime, the griping gets tiresome. You’ve all expressed it. It’s understandable… but it’s done. Move on. Please.

    In a couple of years, we will see by Rackham’s financial health whether they made the right strategic decisions. Personally, I suspect they did.


    Zac says:

    I would just like to say that again, Zac, quoting each ‘negative’ comment and rebutting it makes it look like you are ‘defending’ Rackham.

    I didn’t think I was rebutting it. That certainly wasn’t the intention.

    I do like talking about this though and Gitteau appears game for the debate.

    I do though tend to forget how my comments may be seen by others though so I am not sure what to do in a case where I do want to comment about something that isn’t my usual “rah rah” cheerleading sort of comment.

    Which frankly i’m always surprised more people don’t give me grief for :-)


    Zac says:

    Just to balance a bit, Bey’s comments about complaining and anonymity WERE pejorative. If sales are doing so well, and that kind of commentary irrelevant, why on earth bring it up at all?

    Maybe it just gets him POed?

    I’d be pretty annoyed about it if I was in his shoes.

    As to the thirteen times sales comment, if he is referring to Confrontation when it very first released then it is an apples and oranges comment and not as relevant as might be supposed.

    Indeed. Without context it is a bit difficult to judge how large that actually is.

    In either case its nice to see that it is selling.

    He can just as easily (in fact easier!) do what he did previously and make a general comment saying certain kinds of commentary are not constructive, or should be backed up with concrete assertions.

    That is my actual rule now and so if you see me respond directly to someone then you can assume I am just “shooting the sh*t” as it were.

    My apologies if it seemed I was attempting to censure anyone.

    I do like to still try to elicit more details from people about their comments but I again don’t see that as a censure and people shouldn’t view it as such.

    Its just been my experience that asking people those sort of direct questions does actually usually get some interesting info and does indeed help further the conversation more,


    cegorach says:

    Zac - that’s what I said, it would PO me too :P

    Just to be clear, I am only suggestion on ‘contentious’ issues like Rackham to take more hands-off approach. Best to let the community elicit more detail, as they will, just in a constructive, as opposed to inflammatory, way - which is where general commenting from you will help keep things on an even keel.

    It’s not happening here, but if you do directly approach someone on a sensitive topic you run the risk of them indeed taking it personally and amping it up into a ‘fight’. If that’s two users doing it to each other, then you get the headache of pulling them apart. If you are one of them, then you either end up defending yourself and risking the appearance of bias, or letting it slide and getting justifiably PO’ed.

    But hey, Zac’s house, Zac’s rules :P

    Just suggesting a more distanced role from personal experience. TTGN rocks and its independence is its most shining attribute.


    Zac says:

    But hey, Zac’s house, Zac’s rules

    Next person to say that gets my boot somewhere unpleasant :-)

    Moderation is always a more difficult thing to do when you actually participate in the discussions as well.


    Sentient Bean says:

    It’s all well and good for you and Rackham, Jean, but you know, I really don’t want to have to wait 5-10 years for the quality of PPP to improve to a standard that I find acceptable.

    I was happy with the status quo. It’s such a pity that you weren’t. I don’t think that there was a clamoring for PPP Rackham figures in the market. You made a number of points about the criticism you’ve received and you’ve also alluded to the fact that the opinion of “anonymous” posters (whoever they are… Just about everyone in my area knows who I am on the ‘net because I play games regularly at the local store and clubs) don’t really matter… Jean, not one person in the group of 15 or so Rackham customers I PERSONALLY know have bought your PPP. They have, in the most, bought entire factions of Infinity, Hell Dorado and are waiting for Pulp City. In fact, it’s been noted that the local gaming store (the only major independent store in the Sydney metropolitan area) has had great difficulty shifting TWO of the Confro PPP starter box sets. Jean, Sydney is a city of 4 million people with a reasonably sized gaming community.

    Now it’s all well and good to compare the success of C:AOB to the success of Confro in it’s earliest days, but I think that it’s disingenuous to disregard the 10 years or so of brand history behind the Confrontation name. There are obviously some existing players out there that are rusted on R fans or who like the PPPs. they’re going to account for most of your earliest sales, surely! They’re the ones that are staying anonymous around here! :)

    Anyway, good luck with the figures and you never know, you could change my mind down the track.


    mathieu says:

    I’m surprised people get jacked up about that 13x figure. As Cegorach suggests, this is comparing apples and oranges (which is the question was also doing, so I won’t criticize JB on his comparison). At the time, Rackham stuff was available in less cities (perhaps even stores) than it is in countries now. Any new stuff they ship to stores is bound to start much better than it would have done 10+ years ago. Nothing wrong with being happy about it ;), but it’s no amazing feat either.

    As for the rest of the Q&A, I’m glad it came out, and I’m sure JB did his best to answer as many questions he could with whatever much he was able to reveal. Just an observation, I get the overall feeling that he adopted a rather defensive stance in his answers and comments, which sometimes causes to divert from the actual question.


    Quirkworthy says:

    Hat’s off to JB for the answers. Not perhaps what everyone wanted to hear, but with some reading between the lines you can tell what’s going on. I think he was pretty open and reasonable all told, and I also think he’s right that the quality of the plastic figures is improving - and pretty quickly too. I may well buy the odd one or two myself (to play C3 with).

    It’s also worth remembering that these answers are translated and so the exact tone of the original is perhaps not identical to that it was written in. However good the translator there are inevitably some subtleties that defy the process.

    It’s also great to see some new toys. I especially like the Dwarf Golem. Oddly I’d been looking at two pictures of that only yesterday and wondering if it would ever see the light of day.


    LarkinVain says:

    cegorach, I don’t think any thing really negatively personally. I do want want people to add to the discussion both positive and negative. I think it’s good for everyone. I just read things posted at face value.

    Look forward to reading part 3.


    Psychotic Storm says:

    I don’t know about the rest, but the mech going the legends way is good news for me.
    at least I will be able to buy a few.


    Ady says:

    “Jean, not one person in the group of 15 or so Rackham customers I PERSONALLY know have bought your PPP.”

    Just to counter this, In the store I work in, the new PPP has seen an equivalent swing in uptake. *shrug* I guess it’s all dependant on where you live and what people like.


    primarch says:

    Hi!

    I wonder if the 13x sales in comparisons were smaller or even a negative amount if it would have been perceived as less “apples and oranges”.

    Sales are sales. The comparison was given for the same release time and amount of products available. Thats an equitable comparison.

    Doesn’t surprise me however that negative “spin” will tried against the sales figure. It a damn high different versus metals and totally justifies their change of focus.

    The market has spoken. Loudly.

    Primarch


    AAvH-Darkblade says:

    Complaining” and “anonymity” are clearly meant to be pejorative.

    Complaining is negative but anonymous isn’t really.

    That’s great, but what does anonymity have to do with it?

    Because it is a reality of what happens online. People say negative and rude things in a manner they never would in person at, for example, Gen Con simply because of the anonymity.

    We’ve discussed this very issue here on TGN in a different context and I don’t know that he is attacking any group of people more than he is simply explaining the fact that he listens to sales and not the comments of people who post under pseudonyms.

    —–

    As far as the Anonymity goes, it’s a crock! On the Rackham forums, most of the people “complaining”, were well known to Rackham, either because of the NDAs signed for the Cadwallon play test, from the Con’Fed’s and from the on-line store. There is no way they could not know who is behind my handle “AAvH-Darkblade” from all three sources. Even a Google search will tell you exactly who I am, it is a crock.

    Any one who has spend as much money as I have and been playing since version 2 has a right to express their views, and mine were long, well thought out and eloquent, if I do say so myself. ;)

    Seriously though, I was quite pleased with the responses from Mr. Bey. Particularly with regard to the Con3 support, It’s great that they will at least allow the game to live on, by putting the docs and cards on-line and having the mins available in the Legends line. Though no new profiles will be released there is more then enough already to keep most people busy. The player community for Con3 could certainly create profiles for any really new models coming out. So far there have only been PPPs version of the metal, so it’ll be a while before that is even needed anyway.

    As for CAoR, my position has softened a little, I will at least try it when the Lions are released, with my very heavy & large metal Lions army originally built for Rag’narok. Whether I play more then a few games remains to be seen. Which is a long way from where I was a few months ago. I’m not likely to buy any of the PPPs. Unfortunately, I’ve found At-43 to be a very mediocre game; I’d rather play a 1000 pt Hordesmachine or a 40K game. I’m still playing Con3 and will continue to, but I’ll try CAoR.

    What I have gotten however is a better understanding of where Mr.Bey was coming from when the decisions were made. So for that, I do thank Mr. Bey for taking the time answer these questions as fully and informatively as he has.

    Cheers, AAvH-Darkblade

    p.s. Can’t seem to get the quotes to work, maybe Zac can clean it for me. Thanks.


    Snig says:


    I wonder if the 13x sales in comparisons were smaller or even a negative amount if it would have been perceived as less “apples and oranges”.

    Sales are sales. The comparison was given for the same release time and amount of products available. Thats an equitable comparison.

    Doesn’t surprise me however that negative “spin” will tried against the sales figure. It a damn high different versus metals and totally justifies their change of focus.

    The market has spoken. Loudly.

    The following has nothing to do whether I like to change to PPP or not:

    This is not about negative spin. It is about a meaningless comparison. JB could have compared Confrontation 3 sales with the CAoR sales. That would have made a lot of sense. But comparing the sales before Confrotation has established itself with the situation now, only tells us, that Rackham indeed managed to establish itself in the market in the past 10 years. What it does not tell us is how CoAR does in comparison to Confronation 3.

    It is just simply meaningless if one wants to know how good CAoR is doing - and that is what everyone seems to be interested in. The market may have spoken - but we do not know what it has spoken in the past year. No conclusion how good the PPPs are doing is possible from JB’s information.

    cheers


    duck21 says:

    Actually there are advantages talking face to face rather than unanimously on the internet. Because what you say can’t be deleted. Perhaps that’s the reason Rackham not attending Gen Con Paris this year.


    LarkinVain says:

    Hmmm didn’t know they didn’t go. Who displayed these pieces for them? First time I’ve seen the King Mammoth next to the Therian walker.


    The Grey Knight says:

    “Hmmm didn’t know they didn’t go. Who displayed these pieces for them? First time I’ve seen the King Mammoth next to the Therian walker.”

    Looks like Starplayer in france displayed those for Rackham.


    Zac says:

    Perhaps that’s the reason Rackham not attending Gen Con Paris this year.

    They were in a form of financial protection earlier and perhaps this had some impact on their ability to attend.


    duck21 says:

    It couldn’t be fanatical protection. More likely the French are no longer their target audience. The miniature’s equivalent of junk food is more likely to sell in the States. And Starplayer can avoid any unpleasant questions by saying it has nothing to do with us, we don’t make them. How resourceful.


    LarkinVain says:

    If your assumption that France is no longer it’s target market wouldn’t it be more financially practical to spend money at a con catered to your target audience?

    I hardly think anyone would go to them and ask them any unpleasant questions at a con to the point where they wouldn’t want to come.

    I mean these are still just games. We’re not talking about politics and world events where reporters press on to get questions answered or fans stand in protest around a manufacturer’s booth to show their distaste over something. Not at least in any of the cons I’ve been to.


    Zac says:

    It couldn’t be fanatical protection.

    I assume you meant “financial”? And if so why couldn’t it be the restrictions that they were under while under that financial protection?

    More likely the French are no longer their target audience.

    The French haven’t been their target audience for some time though correct? The AT-43 rulebook was in eight languages so I think its clear that they are looking at a worldwide market for their games now.

    This would have been the case all the way back to Conf v3 which appears, to me at least, to be an attempt to widen the game outside their core French market.

    But in either case I can’t see how that would or would not effect their decision to go to GenCon Paris?


    shwtd says:

    The answers from JB are a little too vague and sometimes, they’re filled with resentment and disdain.

    But, we cannot ignore the fact that the COGs are out soon !!! And finally, that’s the best news ever.

    SHWTD. Karman for ever, excpet for COGs.


    chrixter says:

    Finally!

    In a few weeks time we will be opening on http://www.confrontation.fr a section specially dedicated to the previous editions of Confrontation. It will allow you to download the entire rules of Confrontation 3 as well as its supplement Dogs of War and all Confrontation 3 cards for free since

    Better late than never I guess. The sad things is perhaps that the communities moved to other skirmish games but now there is at least possible to attract new players.


    palaeomerus says:

    It has caused some controversy that Mr. Bey said ” The complaining posted on Internet under cover of anonymity does not represent the reality of the market.”

    My interpretation of that is as follows.

    He is not rebuking his critics because he feels they are cowardly inherently hostile naysayers.

    He is merely stating that anonymity (or pseudonymity) often breeds a certain casualness and informality of thought and expression owing to the lack of any consequences regarding what you say. When nobody knows who you are you are less likely to exercise caution about how accurate what you say is. You tend to become playful, whimsical and impatient because your words are associated with a psuedonym instead of your real name. People are communal, even on computer networks, and so eventually an atmosphere of speaking carelessly develops on a forum.

    That “casualness” aids in the propagation of misunderstandings, exagerations, rumors and can even result in a small loud minority seeming to be a majority. People tend to shoot from the hip and type the first thing that comes to mind or almost blindly repeat what they take for their peer’s consensus opinions.

    This can result in bad PR, both deserved and undeserved that agents of companies like Rackham wish to counter.

    For instance you might see a lot of people loudly hating the music of a certain pop star and not realize that that pop star is one of the forty richest people in Europe and selling more units in a quarter than anyone before him or her. People who see these posts assume that the popstar is hated by EVERYBODY and a sort of fantasy world is created where those who share this opinion will routinely say and believe that which they cannot confirm as if it were objectively true.

    All Mr. Bey seems to be saying is that conclusions about how poorly or well something is received, that are drawn entirely from some forum posts, will be unreliable at best. They and can lead us to accept false conclusions about business, sales, popularity, success in the market, or other subjects. That can affect our buying habits.

    i don’t think he is arrogantly suggesting that anyone who disagrees with him about Conforntation or AT-43 is automatically a member of some clueless peanut gallery, or twisted, angry, cabal of haters who need to get a life or any of that stuff.

    Rather, he is trying to set the record straight and feels that he sees more and better information about how his product sells in the current marketplace than any internet heresay is likely to provide consumers like you and me. He prefers to form his opinions, policies, plans, and market startegies from HIS information rather than relying entirely on feedback gathered from wargaming forums.


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